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tamaranthHilary Mantel in conversation: British Library, 27th May 2009
I've just read Hilary Mantel's latest novel, Wolf Hall, and enjoyed it very much: she makes Thomas Cromwell a sympathetic character despite his disinclination to talk about, or especially like, himself. This event saw her reading from the novel, and in conversation with Erica Wagner (Literary Editor of The Times), and historian Derek Wilson.
HM quoted David Starkey's description of Cromwell as 'Alastair Campbell with an axe'.
Reading: the journey to Dover.
HM quoted Wilson's own remark that executing Cromwell was the most stupid thing that Henry VIII ever did ...
Cromwell's private life is pretty much undocumented -- "a problem and an opportunity". She'd wanted to write about him for years, since before A Place of Greater Safety. She was determined not to get fixated on period language -- but important that the characters didn't have anachronistic ideas.
"A novelist isn't obliged to be impartial but they are obliged to be well-informed."
"There are some books you hear. This was a book I saw" -- talking about the cinematic quality, the immediacy. It's in present tense, tight POV: the present tense forbids hindsight -- essential to historians but for novelists, empathy is more important.
"interplay of irony between novelist and reader" -- writing historical novels unselfconsciously -- novelist and reader sharing knowledge that the characters don't have.
"I don't really like making things up" -- she's uncomfortable with the total absence of facts about Cromwell's personal life, strives to invent events that could have happened, that fit between the things we know.
Cromwell's inner life not anachronistic -- "every good Catholic -- and everyone was a Catholic then -- examines their conscience daily" -- not so remote from modern minds.
Derek Wilson then had a turn: he deplored the public ignorance of British history before getting onto the subject of historical novels. Should historians see novelists as trespassers or fellow spirits? The latter. Novelists do have obligation to get facts right and be fair to their subjects -- but they have 'freedom of the gaps'. Historians can only say 'this is what probably happened': novelists can say 'this could have happened and it's more interesting'. Novelists inject fresh life into history, and encourage readers to empathise.
Henry VIII didn't just have six wives -- he had six Thomases (Cromwell, Wolsey, Wriothesley, Cranmer, More, Howard) -- two beheaded, one burnt, one possibly a suicide.
Question Time!
Audience: Is Wolf Hall 'a metaphor and mirror for our times' as per a recent review?
HM: "One is loath to dismiss a compliment" ... "the present can take care of itself".
Audience (me!): Why the title? They don't go to Wolf Hall ...
HM: It's a tease ... the novel's a progress towards those last two words.
Audience: How many self-made men like Cromwell were there in this period?
DW: Henry VII had put the nobility in their place -- he and his son Henry VIII were keen on merit, so there was room for men like Cromwell, men they could use.
HM: One path to high society was the church; neither More nor Cromwell went this way. Cromwell arrived at court with no coat of arms -- they found an old Cromwell family, tried to persuade Cromwell to use their arms, but no: he waited til he could have his own, then used Wolsey's emblems prominently.
There was intense reverence amongst the common people for tradition, and little enthusiasm for the new. Novelty had to be passed off as old tradition rediscovered.
Another reading -- beware, says HM, a whiff of post-modernism -- the scene near the end where the book begins to engage with itself, where Cromwell's wishing for better maps.
A thoroughly enjoyable talk though I could have done with more Mantel and less Wilson! (Especially his axe-grinding re literary establishment, warranted or not.) One thing that came across strongly was Mantel liking, as well as admiring, Cromwell -- I suspect she couldn't have written Wolf Hall if she didn't have some affection for her subject or at least her version of him.
I've just read Hilary Mantel's latest novel, Wolf Hall, and enjoyed it very much: she makes Thomas Cromwell a sympathetic character despite his disinclination to talk about, or especially like, himself. This event saw her reading from the novel, and in conversation with Erica Wagner (Literary Editor of The Times), and historian Derek Wilson.
HM quoted David Starkey's description of Cromwell as 'Alastair Campbell with an axe'.
Reading: the journey to Dover.
HM quoted Wilson's own remark that executing Cromwell was the most stupid thing that Henry VIII ever did ...
Cromwell's private life is pretty much undocumented -- "a problem and an opportunity". She'd wanted to write about him for years, since before A Place of Greater Safety. She was determined not to get fixated on period language -- but important that the characters didn't have anachronistic ideas.
"A novelist isn't obliged to be impartial but they are obliged to be well-informed."
"There are some books you hear. This was a book I saw" -- talking about the cinematic quality, the immediacy. It's in present tense, tight POV: the present tense forbids hindsight -- essential to historians but for novelists, empathy is more important.
"interplay of irony between novelist and reader" -- writing historical novels unselfconsciously -- novelist and reader sharing knowledge that the characters don't have.
"I don't really like making things up" -- she's uncomfortable with the total absence of facts about Cromwell's personal life, strives to invent events that could have happened, that fit between the things we know.
Cromwell's inner life not anachronistic -- "every good Catholic -- and everyone was a Catholic then -- examines their conscience daily" -- not so remote from modern minds.
Derek Wilson then had a turn: he deplored the public ignorance of British history before getting onto the subject of historical novels. Should historians see novelists as trespassers or fellow spirits? The latter. Novelists do have obligation to get facts right and be fair to their subjects -- but they have 'freedom of the gaps'. Historians can only say 'this is what probably happened': novelists can say 'this could have happened and it's more interesting'. Novelists inject fresh life into history, and encourage readers to empathise.
Henry VIII didn't just have six wives -- he had six Thomases (Cromwell, Wolsey, Wriothesley, Cranmer, More, Howard) -- two beheaded, one burnt, one possibly a suicide.
Question Time!
Audience: Is Wolf Hall 'a metaphor and mirror for our times' as per a recent review?
HM: "One is loath to dismiss a compliment" ... "the present can take care of itself".
Audience (me!): Why the title? They don't go to Wolf Hall ...
HM: It's a tease ... the novel's a progress towards those last two words.
Audience: How many self-made men like Cromwell were there in this period?
DW: Henry VII had put the nobility in their place -- he and his son Henry VIII were keen on merit, so there was room for men like Cromwell, men they could use.
HM: One path to high society was the church; neither More nor Cromwell went this way. Cromwell arrived at court with no coat of arms -- they found an old Cromwell family, tried to persuade Cromwell to use their arms, but no: he waited til he could have his own, then used Wolsey's emblems prominently.
There was intense reverence amongst the common people for tradition, and little enthusiasm for the new. Novelty had to be passed off as old tradition rediscovered.
Another reading -- beware, says HM, a whiff of post-modernism -- the scene near the end where the book begins to engage with itself, where Cromwell's wishing for better maps.
A thoroughly enjoyable talk though I could have done with more Mantel and less Wilson! (Especially his axe-grinding re literary establishment, warranted or not.) One thing that came across strongly was Mantel liking, as well as admiring, Cromwell -- I suspect she couldn't have written Wolf Hall if she didn't have some affection for her subject or at least her version of him.
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Date: Thursday, June 4th, 2009 04:41 pm (UTC)